Rant: Fine line or no line between LO and Camping

[Immanent]

Camping by definition is: In video gaming, camping is a tactic in which a player will obtain a strategic position anywhere on the map and wait for players to arrive and be killed, or waiting for useful objects to appear in an area rather than actively seeking them out.[1]

LO is: Distracting Offense, watching for e-grabs, returning flags sometimes.

Now I believe that there have been a huge increase of campers since the rebirth of LOD.
This is becoming a massive problem in Asian servers, and I myself try to tolerate it as much as possible, before hunting down and tracking down "this" camper. Everybody gets pissed off at them, and I'm wondering if it will be a ban-able offense. 1 Camper is enough to practically reduce a game of CTF to Dm. Which is total bull *chocolate cookies*. It also discourages new bloods from playing, seeing as it is very irritating just to get out of the base, because of a camper. So the questions are:

Will camping be a ban-able offense?
Is it alright to hunt down and kill the camper, or is that just griefing?

Immanent.

 

[Jack]

Really?

 

[Immanent]

Really?

Don't act as if this has never come across your mind. Don't tell me you have never played with a camper, they are just BAD news. If you couldn't say anything better than "Really?", then don't post here.

 

[RockeyRex]

Oooh you should just wait for dem fatties camping them baseasets when that time comes.

 

[Gravis]

That's pretty much my definition of most LO. The entire basis around it is float-shoot-hide. Find a tower/hill, shoot from it; run when they chase, heal, repeat. Everything about that takes no skill other than having decent to good aim. And the HOF can't do *chocolate cookies* unless he want to abandon his post and dodge like mad, though he'll get MA'd regardless due to his size. Of course, that's why there's LD, but the LD have other important functions other than playing TDM all game just to keep 2-3 people out of the base. There's no depth in the position of LO because of that, except for their importance when it comes to returning the flag and such.

I understand, however, that you're defining two parts of the position from people doing their job and people who camp. That's the thing though, because you're now seeing what I see every time and have to put up with as a defender. To me it's similar (yet not the same) as o-sniping; it invokes TDM behavior in games and takes away the CTF aspect of it. And that's how a lot of teams themselves use strategy, in which they'll send 5 offense out of 8 to just TDM with the enemy and keep their hands tied while cappers grab the flag. It shouldn't be like that in CTF.

 

[Abandoned]

[...]it invokes TDM behavior in games and takes away the CTF aspect of it. [...]

THIS! This what makes me want to rant too.
There was this time when I tossed the flag to a teammate, he doesn't even glance to see whats coming at him, calmly jets away from the flag to kill a camper on the outskirts of our base.
In Nivosus, put a Defender - Sentinel in mid field, make him spam clusters at incoming cappers or whatever.

 

[Synista]

I always 'camp' in the enemy base, it's my interpretation of LO too.
If you want 'camping' to be a Ban-able offense in Legions then that's just silly, how hard is it to kill a player? Let alone the fact that if you DON'T camp, you may not be able to get those important E-grabs, distract the HoF and chase and intercept enemy flag passes to base.
Also, in PuG's or Scrims, your leader may request for you to CAMP in the enemy base and wait until the campers say they are incoming.

I'm sorry but Legions is a game where camping is necessary, and if you have a problem with it, play StayD and kill the LO or as you like to call it.. 'Camper'.

In Nivosus, put a Defender - Sentinel in mid field, make him spam clusters at incoming cappers or whatever.

I do that, there's not a problem if you actually do stop the cappers, and whenever I do do it, I find that my teams winning, and I take out 1 or 2 players out of the game because they either QQ or dedicate their time on killing me :') fun fun fun!

 

[Immanent]

how hard is it to kill a player?

Well I'm sorry, I'm not as good as you. Seriously, take in to consideration other people's skill level... not just your own.

 

[Abandoned]

The point of an LO is to be annoying.

 

[Synista]

Well I'm sorry, I'm not as good as you. Seriously, take in to consideration other people's skill level... not just your own.

That's not the point, if you keep trying he'll eventually die

 

[WildFire]

Ninja ftw. Literally. In Euro pickups I don't see enough people knowing how to do this effectively, as they normally just charge at the HoF without any consideration of when the cappers are coming in. Needless to say, they die pretty quick.

 

[Fissurez]

if the LO isnt being killed then their is something wrong with your defence.

 

[St3lth]

if the LO isnt being killed then their is something wrong with your defence.

Not if hes Mabel.

 

[Karnage]

I think a distinction must be made here between a camper and an LO/Ninja. The LO Ninja is there to get the egrabs or to distract the defence while the capper grabs. A camper just sits somewhere and, more often than not, llama grabs the flag and then doesn't make it home. That is all he does the whole game long (think Frostbyte). There is also the other kind of camper which will simply duel as much as possible. He won't go for egrabs and he doesn't distract timeously. He is just playing DM in the enemy base. Those are campers. There is nothing wrong with a guy who is doing a good job at LO though. I suspect Immanent is talking about the 'camper' that I defined here.

 

[Mabeline]

LO is not camping. Bowlparty isn't spawn camping. It's all just harassment. A defense of an equal skill level will completely shut down an LO, you are merely experiencing a skill level mismatch.

Not if hes Mabel.

Especially if it's Mabel.

 

[Propkid]

Camping, as far as I've been CoD/PROMOD-educated is an initially CS developed term that then was 'taken over' by the Call of Duty franchise (and all the overly popular multiplayer FPS games). In CS it used to be strongly bound to the S&D game mode as simply a tactic that a team might or might not choose; there used to be no negative connotation to that. If the defending team camped, then they were doing their job in one of the possible ways. If the offensive team camped, then they were failing to meet the objective and they'd lose.
Then came the CoD series, and TDM/DM became much more popular. Camping gained a negative connotation, as people began abusing it. OP's definition of camping is completely correct, but today's understanding of camping is slightly wrong. In TDM/DM it is wrong to camp, at all times. That's because these aren't tactical game modes. In S&D camping has a purpose (ignore newer CoDs, their map design makes me cry), just like in CoD CTF.
The same applies to L:O's CTF. What you call 'camping' (I actually never had that word come to my mind while playing Legions...) is exactly what LO is meant to do: cause as much commotion and annoyance as possible to let the capper grab the flag. A team might decide not to make use of LO at all, and might invest more in actual cappers (lol), but it's all up to their choice of their tactic.

There is a little TDM game going on in the background during each proper CTF. There's nothing wrong with it; eliminating or annoying the *chocolate cookie* out of the enemy team players surely increases your chances of winning and therefore becomes one of the objectives of the game mode. TBH there are no rules or limits to tactical game modes. Anything can become a tactic.

 

[Immanent]

Solution = votekick or give me hominguns ping!

No solution = Wild Immanent hunting down each and every camper Immanent plays with repeatedly.

Tking? Perhaps.
Way to solve the problem? Most definitely.


Oh yes, I truly am sorry that Euros are missing out this experience.
Next time, I WILL film this such camper, and I WILL post it publicly.

Immanent.

NB:

anything can become a tactic

That argument is invalid. osniping is NOT a tactic. it's just an idiotic method of AIMLESSLY harrassing D and can be done by anybody, because there is no skill requisite, contrary to camping.

You are just experiencing a skill level mismatch

I will gladly give anybody a run for their money on Defense,and hopefully you should be no exception (and yes I have heard about you)

not trying to blow my own horn here (hehe), but heck, I don't think I'm not that bad at D myself, I usually chain people from 100% to 50-30% in 100 ping, but that's besides the point. Chaining a target that constantly hides? Out of the question,

And yes (for those who do not know who I am, or how well I play), I do have people to testify for my skill in certain aspects of the game.

 

[GReaper]

I don't think Immanent is referring to the balance LO vs defenders in decent games. In these games it's just a balancing act of skill, and LO has a purpose as other players on the team are grabbing the flag in the game to try and win.

He's probably referring to pub games where certain players turn a game into team deathmatch. Players on a team who will repeatedly attack LD to kill them whilst their team is probably losing because nobody is grabbing the flag.

If you've got superior skill, duel the player and kill him quickly. Even if you lose one of these encounters, if you can respawn and get to the player quickly enough the chances are you can get back to finish him and you'll be at an advantage with health. If you can't do this alone, ask another player to help you. If you can do this several times and kill the camper without giving him an opportunity to kill anyone else - chances are he'll get bored when he can't kill anyone else.

If you can't handle the camper, just ignore it and do something else. Maybe you could go capping, if the other team is useless because their LO isn't grabbing then you could possibly cap out, or at least have the satisfaction of your team having a higher score.

 

[WildFire]

That argument is invalid. osniping is NOT a tactic. it's just an idiotic method of AIMLESSLY harrassing D and can be done by anybody, because there is no skill requisite, contrary to camping.

Is, but lets not get into that here. Go to one of the many sniping threads.

 

[Immanent]

if the LO isnt being killed then their is something wrong with your defence.

Let's be honest here. We all know that the Asian community is growing smaller, and it takes jerks like these to encourage the decline in players. There are very few people who have the skill it takes eliminate this person, and seeing from the responses, camping will not be ban able. Me and a few other people have decided to take matters into our own hands. But I feel guilty. Why? Griefing? Not so sure. This camper does not register a word typed, nor does he respond. For all you know, s/he might be having gits and shiggles at us, or perhaps reporting us even.

There have been many speculations circulating amongts us that who this camper may be. But I know for sure until I find out exactly who they are, I won't be a passive bystander or victim.

I guess that is my cue to don the cape and the House-of-El symbol.

Excelsior!

Immanent.