Why Tribes?

mausgang

Puzzlemaster
I was trying to figure out which subforum to post this topic in, and while it isn't a suggestion, it is relevant to a lot of the suggestions on this subforum already, so I've decided to put this here. If you have a problem with it, whatever.

The question I have for all you people who have played tribes and want to bring new things to Legions is the following. Why does a lot of the suggestions you have for Legions have its roots in Tribes? I get the Legions is based off of tribes with the mobility, and since I haven't played tribes, I don't know much else except for what I've heard. I've heard the Legions is flat and repetitive compared to Tribes, and I couldn't disagree with that. Legions is in need for new things to happen with it. However, most of the new suggestions come from Tribes. What game are we making here? Legions: Overdrive, or Fallen Empire: Tribes? Legions deserves to be improved, but it should take a different path than its parent. If you like to see Tribes aspects in a game, then that is what Tribes is for. The suggestion I am making to all of the community (okay, so there IS a suggestion in here) is to think outside of the Tribes box. I'm as much for new ideas, but they shouldn't be derived from the parent. Instead, when thinking of new gameplay features such as base defense extras, deployables, and the suchlike, don't just go with the thought process of "What I liked in Tribes and would LOVE to see in Legions is..." Sit down and think of something new, because what you've seen in Tribes has Already been done. This game, since its being developed with suggestions from the community taken in mind, has many new directions it could take, and since that is the case, why should we travel the path previously traveled? Our imaginations, should they be used, are the guiding forces, not just a "copy/paste, then edit to fit legions" approach. We have the opportunity to makes something new and different and we should grab that idea by the horns, so I'm asking for you all to, the next time you think of something, ask yourselves "Was this done in Tribes, and I just want to recreate it in Legions?" There have been some great ideas that have come up that weren't used in Tribes for the best of my knowledge (weapons tethers, for example.) Dare to create some fresh new idea and then test it on the servers. It may not work, but you tried something more new than some of the posts already. These are my two cents and my recommendations on this subforum.
 

Astrum

Super Special R&D
Because those of us who have played Tribes since day one know a lot about the genre and a lot about what works and what doesn't. None of us are advocating Legions copy Tribes exactly, but there's a lot to be learned from Tribes. There's also plenty of stuff in Tribes that won't fit in Legions.

As it stands right now everyone saying they don't want all of these new features pretty much just want Legions to stay the way it is, which is basically LT anyway.
 

mario

Member
Ur right n agree. Finally clever human here. If u wanna bring the things from Tribes into Overdrive, leave it alone n go to play Tribes. It is Legions.
 

Astrum

Super Special R&D
Ur right n agree. Finally clever human here. If u wanna bring the things from Tribes into Overdrive, leave it alone n go to play Tribes. It is Legions.

By that logic we should stop playing all of these new fangled games. I mean, Wolfenstein 3D had guns and a first person perspective way back in 1992, and there were games before it that had those things. We should just go back to playing those, all games since are exactly the same after all.

Seriously, some of you need to think a bit more. And perhaps go play Tribes.
 

warker

New Member
Ill agree with thinking outside the box in order to bring some unique ideas into Legions. But Tribes has so many features that can help Legions be a stronger game. One thing I think we all need to understand is that even if Legions uses some Tribes features it wont be anything like how it was in Tribes. Legions is a much faster paced game than Tribes so if all the stuff I loved about Tribes is brought into Legions chances are some of it would be terrible and wouldn't work with Legions because of how fast of a game Legions is. But hey I think we should still try it out ;)
 

mario

Member
By that logic we should stop playing all of these new fangled games. I mean, Wolfenstein 3D had guns and a first person perspective way back in 1992, and there were games before it that had those things. We should just go back to playing those, all games since are exactly the same after all.

Seriously, some of you need to think a bit more. And perhaps go play Tribes.
What is a bit more? Could it be a bit more if Legions Overdrive called Legions: Tribes? Tribes Universe is coming soon, what for are these players waiting? Still did not get a point T:U will be came and they want more, like in Legions which was the great what it was. Nothing has not to change in the future just shear this game with the chimera/idea be than Tribes or just a bit. Isnt it enough? I think.
 

SeymourGore

Flatulent Cherub
Alright, what I want to hear from you guys is "What is Legions?". I keep hearing this term: "Tribes is Tribes and Legions is Legions, so keep it that way."

My confusion about this term is that Legions is very much an incomplete game. How can such a shell of a game have its own 'identity' yet? It's starting to surface (increased air mobility over tribes, overdrive system), but its own 'identity'?

As for the comparisons and suggestions similar to those found in Tribes, well, they're both in the same genre, Tribes is basically the granddaddy of these fps+z games, so there's bound to be comparisons and suggestions between the two of them.

Do I think all of the elements from Tribes can (or should) be ripped into Legions? Of course, not. Some gameplay elements would not fit into the scope for Legions, and others need to be drastically rethought to be effective.

As for the hate-on for Starsiege: Tribes (and Tribes 2). Try playing the game more extensively (if you haven't even given it a shot, I'm even more dumbfounded that you're criticizing it so much), you'll then understand why its underlying concepts were so popular and, how, when reworked and evolved, these concepts could help Legions become a much better game.
 

warker

New Member
As for the hate-on for Starsiege: Tribes (and Tribes 2). Try playing the game more extensively (if you haven't even given it a shot, I'm even more dumbfounded that you're criticizing it so much), you'll then understand why its underlying concepts were so popular and, how, when reworked and evolved, these concepts could help Legions become a much better game.

Amen Brotha Gore
 

Dacil

Member
Sit down and think of something new, because what you've seen in Tribes has Already been done. This game, since its being developed with suggestions from the community taken in mind, has many new directions it could take, and since that is the case, why should we travel the path previously traveled? Our imaginations, should they be used, are the guiding forces, not just a "copy/paste, then edit to fit legions" approach. We have the opportunity to makes something new and different and we should grab that idea by the horns, so I'm asking for you all to, the next time you think of something, ask yourselves "Was this done in Tribes, and I just want to recreate it in Legions?"

I agree with creating completely new ideas and maybe, just maybe try something that was very minor from Tribes into Legions, otherwise yes, go play Tribes because Legions shouldn't just be a recreation especially when other Tribes projects are out there. Every time I see a suggestion and I see "like there was in tribes" I get disinterested quickly and sigh
 

Disci

Old man
I can't wait the day when all the most popular Tribes 1 maps are made for Legions and people are "wtf these maps are great!". Good things comes from Tribes serie. You can't believe how many popular games today has taken ideas which were originaly used in Tribes games and use them to make their game more appealing.

Legions already has few major improvements(some may disagree) like downjet and OD which are unique to the genre. These things alone does make some good things, which are in Tribes games, almost impossible to import to Legions.
 

Disci

Old man
"How can you know what works and what doesn't in a game that did not receive sufficient recognition? Tribes was a failure and has been dead for a long time now. I'm sorry to bust your balls, but that is reality."

Oh god how wrong you are. Xtreme, your facts are not facts at all. Let us hear why it was a failure?

Your friends may think Legions is stupid because it's not Halo, CoD or MW2...
 

Dacil

Member
Your friends may think Legions is stupid because it's not Halo, CoD or MW2...

or because legions does take some skill, unlike Halo... ehem but anyways he has a strong opinion and I agree his opinion is not a fact so I wouldn't word that so strongly X
 

Pushi

Member
Stop labeling every idea and deciding its bad just because it originates from tribes. So what if its from tribes ? Think for the idea itself not for where it comes from?
As long as it would make the gameplay better and more interesting its welcome for consideration regardless from which game it comes ? why so much hate on every guy that mentions something from tribes, i for once never played it (much) but i dont see anything wrong with considering some ideas originating from tribes series since its a similar genre,as long as it would Make "our" Legions better.

Discuss the idea itself,and how it would fit in legions, not its origins.
 

Dacil

Member
Stop labeling every idea and deciding its bad just because it originates from tribes. So what if its from tribes ? Think for the idea itself not for where it comes from?
As long as it would make the gameplay better and more interesting its welcome for consideration regardless from which game it comes ? why so much hate on every guy that mentions something from tribes, i for once never played it (much) but i dont see anything wrong with considering some ideas originating from tribes series since its a similar genre,as long as it would Make "our" Legions better.
might be because people who've been looking at the suggestions forums for 1+years and keep seeing the same thing are getting annoyed? not totally sure but to me it's annoying...trying ideas out from tribes to legions to see if it would improve the game wouldn't hurt, but maybe make it a separate version at first to get feedback on how everyone likes it before it becomes concrete? idk seems like a lot of work but I would like as new things Tribes related are incorporated into Legions, to be separate from the version of Legions already out, if that makes sense...people who want to try out the new stuff can do so at the same time that people who don't can play the other...like the Nanu servers (think that's what they were called)
 

Astrum

Super Special R&D
How can you know what works and what doesn't in a game that did not receive sufficient recognition? Tribes was a failure and has been dead for a long time now. I'm sorry to bust your balls, but that is reality.

Tribes was a failure? What are you smoking. Tribes 1 had 1,000 fold more players than Legions ever did. Tribes 2 almost certainly topped Tribes 1 even with the rocky start and the Dynamix shutdown, it did at least in terms of profit anyway. It left a gigantic mark on the industry. Countless games took inspiration from it, including AAA titles that are still spawning sequels today. Had Dynamix not gotten the axe Tribes may still be around right now.

I'd also like to point out that to this day, 12 years after Tribes 1 came out, there are more Tribes players then Legions players in its prime. So really, if you want to talk about a game that has already failed, Legions is it. It's a bloody miracle that as a community we can work with it and actually finish it.

Again, I'm not saying we should just make Legions into Tribes, someone can mod that if we're lucky. The Legions gameplay style is just like LT at the moment, so it already is Tribes like in absolutely every sense of the word. However, it's still its own game. The skiing is completely different, the mobility in the air is amazingly different, and overall it doesn't even feel like Tribes except that it's in the same genre. Adding base assets isn't going to magically remove downjet and turn it in to Tribes, but it will make the game playable. 99% of the suggestions I saw in the old-old forum were suggestions for gameplay elements in an entirely different genre which would never work out. So while so many people here are shrugging off Tribes for fear that the game will somehow get better, what do you actually suggest we put in the game?
 

ContingencyPl4n

Elite Pro Mapmaker
He's how I see it. I used to play dota quite a bit back in the day. After a few years, demigod is announced. I got into the beta for it. Where do you think most of the ideas came from? Dota was a one-of-kind game, thus demigod had only one game to look to for basic inspiration(sp), while still trying to expand. After some time, LoL came into beta and I also got into that. Same concept. One game to get the basics from.

Legions is in the same boat. It has one series it falls back to for the basics of gameplay. As a serious example, base assets were an integral(sp) part of the game, so that is why people want them in. HOW this happens is up to us, and the devs.
 

Redvan

Private Tester
the biggest thing that FE:L could "copy" of Tribes would be physics. Currently (and thankfully), FE:L does not copy tribes in this manner.

Most other things: Vehicles, deployables, different armors, weapons, game types, etc... are "copies" off of many different video games. Most of these things aren't inherently "Tribes based".

If an idea comes from another game and it works, great, use it, even if it is tribes. If it doesn't work in L:O, then don't use it. Simple as that.
 
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