General Core Feedback

Jordahan

World Leader of The 21st Century
3/24 - Live Changes
-Regen Core overhaul. Hold activate core to start draining energy for health. After 3 seconds you will create an AOE pulse healing nearby allies for 25 damage.

-Warp core back to its old rules. You can now enter a scar while holding the flag though.

I am excited for the new regen core, it was fun testing it yesterday, should be good to see how it plays out in Pubs. However I do not want the old warp back, I loved the new mechanic of it, I think if you take the "new" warp and just add that you can't warp with the flag in your hands it'll be awesome. I don't really see a reason to change it back to the way it was before.
 

WildFire

Warrior of Linux
From what I can gather, the warp core has only been changed back due to the people who used it before were whining about it. I personally loved the new core and found it much more simplistic to use while maintaining it's usefulness. I'm very split about holding the flag in your hands though. I did like the fact that it did take more health away from you if you are holding the flag.
 

Jordahan

World Leader of The 21st Century
From what I can gather, the warp core has only been changed back due to the people who used it before were whining about it. I personally loved the new core and found it much more simplistic to use while maintaining it's usefulness. I'm very split about holding the flag in your hands though. I did like the fact that it did take more health away from you if you are holding the flag.
I suggested it before but I said if you were holding the flag it should do a significant amount of damage.
 

Fixious

Test Lead
1.40 warp made chasing pretty much impossible, even with the damage buff. Chasers were the ones whining about it, not those who enjoyed warp previously. I suggested an (additional) increase in damage if holding onto the flag as well in some other thread. The newest warp allows you to go through other player's warp scars, and the scar itself got some buffs (duration, size).

I don't recall the exact damage it did previously if you warped with the flag. 20%? 50% would be a decent start if we were to go back to it.
 

Jordahan

World Leader of The 21st Century
1.40 warp made chasing pretty much impossible, even with the damage buff. Chasers were the ones whining about it, not those who enjoyed warp previously. I suggested an (additional) increase in damage if holding onto the flag as well in some other thread. The newest warp allows you to go through other player's warp scars, and the scar itself got some buffs (duration, size).

I don't recall the exact damage it did previously if you warped with the flag. 20%? 50% would be a decent start if we were to go back to it.
The 1.4 damage was 15 for normal warp, 23 with flag.
 

WildFire

Warrior of Linux
1.40 warp made chasing pretty much impossible, even with the damage buff. Chasers were the ones whining about it, not those who enjoyed warp previously. I suggested an (additional) increase in damage if holding onto the flag as well in some other thread. The newest warp allows you to go through other player's warp scars, and the scar itself got some buffs (duration, size).

I don't recall the exact damage it did previously if you warped with the flag. 20%? 50% would be a decent start if we were to go back to it.

Oh? Over in EU it was mostly a different story, cappers complaining that warp generally "sucked". I did try chasing through warp scars and had absolutely no problem doing so.
 

Poponfu

Lead Developer
From what I can gather, the warp core has only been changed back due to the people who used it before were whining about it. I personally loved the new core and found it much more simplistic to use while maintaining it's usefulness. I'm very split about holding the flag in your hands though. I did like the fact that it did take more health away from you if you are holding the flag.

We will take a look at it again down the line more closely this time. There were some severely broken things about the new one being abused.. sounds like they had not figured it out on EU yet. It was safer for now just to go back to the old version.
 

Fixious

Test Lead
I should post some demos of Jicker and others absolutely abusing the crap out of it. It did need some changes, though I was a bit fond of being able to warp with flag (but again, it needed additional damage buffs, and hell maybe even a speed nerf).
 

FireBlitz

Member
I should post some demos of Jicker and others absolutely abusing the crap out of it. It did need some changes, though I was a bit fond of being able to warp with flag (but again, it needed additional damage buffs, and hell maybe even a speed nerf).


Hehehe I'd LOVE to see that footage! I'm glad the old warp is back, now I can actually try to chase Jick. :) The old warp wasn't bad, it's just the fact that it gave cappers such a huge advantage, that some players found a way to get back to the home base without actually touching the ground. And with its mechanics it was just impossible to get close enough to even scratch them. It was just ridiculous.
 

Poponfu

Lead Developer
The old warp wasn't bad, it's just the fact that it gave cappers such a huge advantage, that some players found a way to get back to the home base without actually touching the ground. And with its mechanics it was just impossible to get close enough to even scratch them. It was just ridiculous.

While the new one fixed llamas , it allowed that with ease, on really unplanned hills. Was why we went back to this slightly less OP version where that takes a setup route. What do you guys think would be the happy medium of the two where llamas are prevented and unchasable warps midfield ?
 

FireBlitz

Member
While the new one fixed llamas , it allowed that with ease, on really unplanned hills. Was why we went back to this slightly less OP version where that takes a setup route. What do you guys think would be the happy medium of the two where llamas are prevented and unchasable warps midfield ?

Well, the way it is now seems good for me. However, if there was a way where the capper retained the speed he has when he makes the warp scar, and the chaser gets capper's speed when he enters warp, would be awesome. I don't think it's OP that players can warp with the flag, as long as it takes a significant amount of damage (sort of the amount boost core has?), as Fixious had said before. That way there is no llamas with warp, and players can still get creative with their routes without having that big advantage of midfield warps to home base.
 

Poponfu

Lead Developer
Warping with the flag and retaining your speed is broken unless you wanna do like 75% damage to a outrider just so most the time they cant do it and then whats the point ? We had that damage amount on there for 2 nights and it was still abused and made the games quite un-fun.
 

FireBlitz

Member
Ah.. Well, in that case, I'm happy with the way it is ATM. I really don't mind llamas with warp, they're quite easy to chase, and cappers do just fine with it.
 

Fixious

Test Lead
If damage isn't enough to affect it, how about a speed nerf as well? If someone with the flag activates warp, it sends them back 3 seconds at 75% of their current speed. That, along with the damage could be a decent alternative.
 

Fixious

Test Lead
Last I checked (a day or two ago) you still aren't in the orientation of the capper when entering their scar, but your orientation going into it. Was told this would get changed.
 

Maxter

Member
Posted this in the announcements section earlier thinking this thread was dead. Just noticed the recent posts. Also added to it in response to latest changes in the game.

Alright, so I'm back on my PC after a whole month, downloaded the new Live version and played a long while with most of the latest stuff. Just wanted to drop a bit of feedback regarding that.

Regen Core: Love the new mechanics. When I was playing in a "proper" game, I was LO with the Regen Core. I noticed that it has become a bit of an annoyance to hold the button rather than to just tap it which was previously the case. Because of the small cooldown and the good bit of health regeneration(pros of the core), I feel that the button hold mechanic is the right one for this kind of core, justifying those two pros even if it's a bit irritating to use.

Healing others is a bit of a hassle. I healed my flag carrier once and I tried to do it again, but ended up making him throw the flag as I probably looked like I wanted him to pass it to me. This isn't a problem with the core, it's just a matter of being aware of what your teammate is trying to do. I was actually a bit surprised by his action cause the healing effect of the core is clearly visible.

Too bad the Ally healing is 25 points and not 25 % heal to the ally, don't know if that's even possible cause 25 points aren't much for heavies since their health pool is the largest and natural regen rate, the slowest. If it's 25% it'll be worthwhile to heal a heavy when he's got the flag, and that kind of thing might even encourage players to go heavy on D more often and get help from one other player to heal them every now and then. There isn't also a way to abuse this to constantly heal the heavy, as I've noticed today that it's really hard to heal the other player while under attack(the target keeps moving). Overall, I think this core is very useful especially in the hands of people who like to take on supportive roles like Stay-D and Capper Escort.

Dodge Core: Another core I played around with for a while today. I have mixed feelings on this one. First of all, I'm bummed out that it's not "dodge where I point to". I've felt this way since the day it was introduced. Wish it was more like the iOD, where I get to dodge to where I point and not in the direction of the last key pressed. Also, I feel that the cooldown time is a bit much, kinda breaks the rhythm or something, can't put my finger on it.

My suggestion for this core would be to change it so that you dodge to where you see(i.e. to where your reticle is pointing), and not according to the last directional key pressed. Also would like to see something like a bounce-off mechanic after hitting a wall. Like let's say I look at the wall at an angle like 45deg up and dodge, I hit the wall, bounce and travel a 10m extra distance after. The 10m would be the distance no matter at what point of the core's activation your body touches the wall(won't work if you hit the wall after the dodge core subsides).

Shield Core: Well, I'm not sure how the current mechanic will fare(the 2 second activation with 50% damage resistance), but just in case it doesn't seem that effective, here's my idea. Make it hold "R" mechanic, complete damage nullifying capability until energy is 0(like the previous tap R to activate/deactivate iteration). Basically, what this does is to allow the player to time his shield activation by holding R and releasing it when the danger has passed. So I guess it's more accurate to say he's holding up the shield rather than activating it. There will be no energy gain while the shield is up, instead the energy will be drained at a minor pace.

There will be no cooldown between uses of the shield. The player will be given seamless access to the core with only the energy to be paid as price for the damage nullification. But, if the player's shield is up, and his energy being too low for the shield to fully block the damage, there will be a shield break effect which will add a cooldown penalty of 10 seconds. For example, let's say I held up my shield at 25% energy and got directly hit by a rocket, my shield would "break" and the core will enter a 10 second cooldown as penalty. It's pretty much a warning to the player; Use the core whenever you need it, but don't overuse it. The 10 sec penalty is just what I was able to think of, I was also thinking reduced energy regeneration but that could be overkill.

Boost Core: Could use a bit of damage debuff. I mean while it's made to provide newbies an alternative who can't use the Boost grenades, it's quite punishing. You also can't ignore the fact that the one "Core slot" is used for the boost, people who are able to boost with the grenades equip other cores like Regen/Shield and carry an advantage.

Let me know what you guys think.
 

Poponfu

Lead Developer
Shield Core: Well, I'm not sure how the current mechanic will fare(the 2 second activation with 50% damage resistance), but just in case it doesn't seem that effective, here's my idea. Make it hold "R" mechanic, complete damage nullifying capability until energy is 0(like the previous tap R to activate/deactivate iteration). Basically, what this does is to allow the player to time his shield activation by holding R and releasing it when the danger has passed. So I guess it's more accurate to say he's holding up the shield rather than activating it. There will be no energy gain while the shield is up, instead the energy will be drained at a minor pace.

I still don't see shield being used much with the new changes. This might be good to try.
 

Maxter

Member
OK, now that we got the SG server setup and Karnage back on the team, we were able to play a couple of matches in <100 ping and I was able to test out some of the latest installments to the game in a new scenario.

If you ever play a PUG, you should definitely try out the HoF + Regen Stay-D combo in the game. It's really fun and effective. The best thing about it is; you need to properly communicate with your teammate to get it right. Not only that, today when we tried out that combo, and it forced the enemy LO to think on how to beat us, it was great as they were forced to switch out their loadouts and adapt overall. The team timing their moves right, while also maintaining good communication among it's teammates thereby wins.

For example, when I was Regen Core healing Karnage who played HoF, it was difficult for JC's team to kill him fast enough to retrieve. The fun part was, Karnage's Blaster Rifle set them a time limit to either retrieve or respawn. They couldn't use their usual hit, hide, and run tactics as Outriders as I was there to heal him. So then, they were forced to choosing between either rush him or just wait for each other to get back to the base. After a while, they'd realized that I was the real threat and started going after me first. Just from all this, I have to say I'm loving how Legions gameplay has changed. Really reminded me of Global Agenda type of Medic-Assault gameplay.

Anyhow, in the second match, JC switched to the EMP grenades and began shutting off my core at the right time, right when Karnage utterly needed a heal. While they proved to be effective at times, I have to say that I really felt that the EMP grenades shouldn't be the only ones with the Core-annulling property. Perhaps one of the already existing weapons which can produce that effect with Alt-fire? I was thinking the Skybolt with an Alt-fire version of Hold-and-release mechanic which would loose a short-mid ranged shot(much like sniper mechanic but with a projectile, and also like a shotgun which doesn't spray but has comparably similar range) which would lockdown target's core for, say 5 seconds? Since, it's basically a weapon like any other, it should also be hitting friendlies, just my thought.

One more thing, because we're only facing like 2 LO most of the time, one of them with 250 ping, it wasn't that easy for them to kill Karnage, with me healing him. Still, I felt like my RC healing was next to negligible(on a Sentinel). Therefore I think the heal effect on Sentinels should atleast be 40 points for it to actually matter, otherwise, the HoF's just better off respawning.

Overall though, I have to say we had a lot of fun. If the few things I mentioned above and in my previous post could be looked at, I think it would be great. Hope I'm not being a nuiscance with all these feedback posts.
 
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