PuG NIGHT BOYS

Dragonz11111111

New Member
As much as I enjoy pugs, sometimes I find pubs more fun simply because people don't give too much of a *chocolate cookies* about winning, but care more about just doing what they want and enjoying themselves. No matter what you play pubs or pugs, you want to have fun and still win, but pugs are far more competitive and as a result I think people stop focusing on fun and starting leaning towards "Oh, I really want to win". And there's nothing wrong with that but eventually people get so caught up in winning that they forget about just having fun. And I feel that this level of competition is where most of this frustration, rage and general anger and toxicity come from.

So my suggestion would be to just play a game (or two) where we all just stayed in one big call. We would pick teams as usual but then not split off in two channels, instead it would just be one giant chat. Effectively you change the tone of the game, the game becomes significantly less competitive (due to the fact its harder to strategize) you spend more time talking, socializing, relaxing , screwing around and having fun with others. I don't want to completely remove the competitive factor from pugs, but I think having a break in between and just chilling will help everyone maintain a better attitude.
 

tree

Member
What? No. As a European player, I would not partake in PUGs just to listen to people "screwing around" having stayed up until 1AM on a Sunday morning. Legions PUGs being competitive is the sole reason I play in them, and I doubt I am alone in that. Wanting to win is (of course) going to be a factor in anything competitive, but surely that's when people will start trying and (hypothetically) the enjoyment for all those trying will be greater. You must also remember, that winning implies a player (I would assume) having a good team, and playing well themselves too, all of which adds to the enjoyment factor.

If a PUG is close, I would guess that the teams are working well together and that the communication is good (which usually results in happy players), and the players will care far less about the outcome. But if it's a landslide victory for one team, then the team on the losing side will not have enjoyed it (as it implies bad teamwork, unfavourable teammates, et cetera). I doubt they care about the loss; merely the time spent participating in something they didn't enjoy.

Your organised PUB sounds good, but I wouldn't like to see it instead of pugs. I can't think of when one would organise it (possibly earlier on PUG evening?) though.
 
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Xtreme

shaska's bff
That's a cool idea, but I imagine it would be a bit chaotic and tbh kind of ruins the point of pickups. I think we always play some good matches, even with the occasional snobbery. You guys should be happy we are playing at all. Cut that *chocolate cookies* from 2011 and start trying new things - new captains, new maps, new positions. That's the only way to keep this going.
 

Fixious

Test Lead
Dragonz isn't suggesting we replace PUG night with pubs. Just mixing in one or two casual games between the more organized/competitive ones. I don't really care what happens at this point, so long as we play and it isn't Zenith.
 

Stubbsy

Contributor
I mean, I'd love to captain but I have no idea how to. When I next play a PUG, I'll give it a go!
 
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Jello

Contributor
If only we found some way for people to actually captain :eek:
It's the fear of losing and not knowing who to choose. I had that feeling when I first tried to captain but you gradually get over it and the more you play the more players you know but once a bad decision is made the whole team blames the captain, if a player is the problem the whole team blames the player, it's kinda stupid how people don't play it for fun instead of having the winning and losing mentality. I've never blamed a player or a captain for losing a game, I just say we tried and good game
 

IzSid

Honored Hero
Dragonz isn't suggesting we replace PUG night with pubs. Just mixing in one or two casual games between the more organized/competitive ones. I don't really care what happens at this point, so long as we play and it isn't Zenith.

y do u hate the only good map

/s
 

WildFire

Warrior of Linux
Dragonz isn't suggesting we replace PUG night with pubs. Just mixing in one or two casual games between the more organized/competitive ones. I don't really care what happens at this point, so long as we play and it isn't Zenith.

I must ask, I've forgotten, I think you told me, but why the hate for Zenith? Despite being overplayed, it is a reasonably balanced map.
 

Fixious

Test Lead
I don't enjoy capping on it. I don't enjoy LO'ing on it. It's generally terrible in pubs (espeically for cappers), which is why we rarely see or switch to it. I just...don't like it, and will likely sit out from now on if it's picked (pulling a reverse Homi). I'm tired of Frost as well and will also sit out from now on if it's anything above 7s and there are an odd number of players. Even Whiteout, a map I made, bores me. I sorta wish we'd limit teams instead of always including everyone. It sucks to sit, but I'd rather see a more focused game get played than a 9v9 Whiteout or even 8v8 Frost. Smaller games are pretty much always better, even 6s.

To be honest, looking at the map list, I'm not too fond of any particular map right now. The last Qualm PUG was decent I guess. I wouldn't mind trying out Sleepwalker or OTtN again.
 
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Poponfu

Lead Developer
OTtN used to play pretty well and was always decently fun, not too sure why we stopped playing it.

We played it once maybe three weeks ago and it was a good game. I think it is a case where its a better pug than pub map, like Zenith. Legions community has always been weird about maps, even more so now. Since it is so small just a few loud naysayers and maps get a wider stigma of being bad. It has gotten better in the past few months though, people try to be quiet when captains pick not often played maps. It comes down to the same people captaining all the time too.
 

Application-1

test bester
So the forums have had people complainging lately and true I was not there at last weekend where supposedly stuff happened. But to me it sounds just a handfull of people complaining where as the majority just thinks eh w.e we will keep on playing and keep having fun. This tends to happen to groups of people. So I ask everyone to keep everything in perspective.

About the part where people are all like:
Aw man I wanna win I gotta focus I cant have fun because of it cause I gotta win.
You are playing a competitive game where you play against eachother not computers. The competitive part is the fun part. If you join a pug thinking oh wtf man these guys are so serious I can´t play like this while having fun. Then it is your problem not others.

I also heard about some murmurs of people complaining about people getting frustrated ingame. But let me hit you up with a fact.
It actually is annoying if someone plays a position and 4 times in a row something is asked of that person and even though he/she tries the best that person can do he/she just keeps messing up. And mostly people are crying over this in my opinion.

Check yoself before you rek yoself.

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So lets try to have fun pugs this weekend boys and girlssssssssssssssss. Ill captain if I can make it or fall asleep.

EDIT: Just playing other maps because you need your diversity fix is just not how it works. A good map is good. A bad one is bad. Sure there is room to increase the map pool but don't show up, sit in the channels and say im playing if we dont play map x. That is childish and boring. ESPECIALLY if you had the chance to be a captain and picked a map yourself. Considering that taking a captain slot always take ages everyone had plenty of chances.
Gorge for example is a great underplayed map imo.
 
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TylerMarket

Heisenberg.
Pugs are practically all that's left in this game in terms of real nontrolly games and i don't want to see them go away just because of a few differences in opinions
 

Jello

Contributor
Can we maybe try to mix things up a bit? Instead of picking teams, playing a map, then going back to picking teams again, can we try picking teams and playing a best of 3? If teams are obviously uneven we can go back to picking, but if the games are relatively close just keep them and play the next map right away.

Can anyone explain why we never went ahead with this idea? I feel like this could fix all our problems.......or make them worse :D
 

WildFire

Warrior of Linux
I'd rather we have a system where a map has predefined team sizes i.e.
Frostbyte would only be 6v6 or 7v7. Then, only play a map ONCE per night based
on those team sizes. We have more than enough small and large maps to make
this work. It would also stop overcrownding on smaller maps such as Frostbyte
and hopefully get some of the larger maps that are rarely played (qualm, core,
forgotten) seen.
 

Fixious

Test Lead
Wednesday PUGs need some changing, since barely anyone shows up to them. Pushing it back to 9pm has been suggested, since people usually show up after 8:30pm sometimes. We could also choose a game mode that actually works if only 6-10 people show up, such as TDM or Team Rabbit.

That or just cancel them altogether and stick to Saturdays.
 
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